Ijeoma Oluo’s straightforward, accessible book, So You Want to Talk About Race, is a primer for Americans who are serious about facing our racist history and fighting institutionalized racism. It dropped January 16th, and it’s already a New York Times Bestseller in its third printing. Oluo, who is Editor-at-Large of The Establishment (and full disclosure, a friend of mine), doesn’t hold back when discussing White Supremacy and the realities of racism.

So You Want to Talk About Race takes on the difficult conversations we should all be having on issues like privilege, the “N” word, Black Lives Matter, how classism fits in, and more. Oluo proposes and answers questions that many of us have, including ones we haven’t been asking, but should have been. I recently spoke with Oluo to learn more about her experiences writing and promoting the book, her hopes for those who read the book and more. A master of multitasking, Oluo skillfully handled these heavy topics while also applying her makeup for yet another interview (she is also a badass makeup artist).  

Ijeoma Oluo

GrokNation: I love that you provide so much information in this book–history, personal examples, specifics. A lot of people are hungry for ideas on how to fix things. How did you decide what to include?

Ijeoma Oluo: For me, it was a combination of questions I, and many other POC, are asked all the time, and questions that I wish were asked more. My inbox is filled with questions from white people. Just absolutely filled. And they assume that I will take the time to write out a couple paragraphs for their very specific problems, for free, because I should be glad a white person’s asking.

Now you can just link them to the book!

Yes! And that’s probably a reason why I wrote it, so I don’t have to answer the same question over and over and over again. I looked through my email, my Twitter feed, my DM’s, to find those questions. I wrote each chapter knowing full well that there were white people who would see themselves in those questions, but also knowing full well that there were POC who would recognize those questions. And maybe the questions were ones they weren’t immediately prepared to answer. I wrote with both audiences in mind.

Are you concerned that the folks who need to read your book will dismiss it right off the bat?

If you’re not at the point where you can pick up the book and honestly engage with it, then you’re not who I wrote for. There are so many people who think they “get it” and are doing the right thing and care, and are willing to attempt to investigate where they’re falling short — those are the people I want to reach out to, the people who are willing to try and do better.

A lot of folks say “I’m going to give this to my racist uncle, because he needs to read it!” And I’m like, “Cool, but I actually wrote it for you.” I feel like there’s a much greater middle who thinks they get it, or knows they don’t get it, but maybe are embarrassed or nervous about how to move forward. I feel like we do ourselves a disservice by ignoring broad swaths of the middle in favor of trying to convert rampant racists. There’s so much we can be doing in house, and within our own political/social spectrum to fix things first.

I am definitely hearing from a lot of people committed to social justice work, who are like, “This really had me thinking. This really had me going back, wondering do I really get it as I thought I did, and finding areas I’ve been ignoring where I can make a bigger difference.” And that’s been really good to hear from white progressives.

You’re never going to graduate from anti-racism school. If I fight to remove barriers, then future generations that didn’t grow up with the barriers I did, will see other opportunities for change, and might see where my work has fallen short.

This book topic is intense. How are you taking care of yourself during the promotion of the book?

Self care isn’t something I do. I don’t know what that means, I don’t know what it looks like. Self care is the work that I do, in the hope that I eventually won’t have to do it everyday. No matter what, I’m still a Black woman at the end of the day. If I was to take a break from the work, I’m still a Black woman everyday. That is still my reality, it’s still my world.

In all honesty, it’s interesting, because when you’re writing about race and promoting a book, you end up having the same conversations over and over again. I was really lucky in my WNYC interviews, for both times, to be interviewed by people of color, which was really nice, because the questions I was asked were different. But that’s the exception, rather than the rule. Almost every interview I’ve had on this has been with white people, and I think everyone thinks they’re asking unique questions. But it’s basically the same ones: ‘Why did you want to write about racism in the first place?’

Interested in moving this conversation on racism forward?

Here are a few action items from So You Want to Talk About Race, but make sure to read the book for many more:

Vote Local. Many of us make sure to get out every four years for the presidential election. But, Oluo stresses the importance and need for voting at the local level as well. You have easier access to those who represent you locally, and can ask them to make racial justice a priority.

Support POC-owned businesses. This is an easy one to manage! The next time you run out to do errands, make a conscious decision to spend your money at a business owned and run by people of color. Whether it’s a dry cleaner, restaurant, or corner bodega, where you spend money makes an impact.

Boycott businesses that exploit workers of color. Stop supporting businesses that treat their workers of color poorly. That means no more eating out at restaurants that pay less than they should and subject workers to unhealthy and unsafe conditions.

Support music, film, television, art, and books created by people of color. You haven’t seen Black Panther yet? Go fix that!